What happens when you’ve installed more than 1,000 dust control fan systems over 15 years? You gain a unique perspective on what really works in combustible dust housekeeping.
In this episode of the OnAire Podcast, veteran installer Darrell Cloudt shares practical lessons from hundreds of manufacturing facilities across the wood, grain, plastics, food, and paper industries. He explains why overhead dust is almost always worse than plant teams realize, why pre-cleaning and preventive maintenance are essential, and how simple communication during a project can prevent costly surprises.
If you’re responsible for plant reliability, housekeeping, maintenance, or EH&S, this episode offers real-world advice that goes beyond regulations and focuses on helping facilities stay cleaner, safer, and more productive. It’s an honest conversation packed with lessons learned from thousands of hours spent solving dust problems in the field.
Episode Transcript:
Hey, here we are back on set for another episode of the OnAire podcast. I’m Jordan.
And I’m Taylor.
Hey, it’s time to go. Episode 18, one-eight. I heard recently that the average length of a podcast is only 10 episodes. So hey, we’re over the hill. Let’s go.
Yeah, we are. We’re almost double that.
We’re official.
Crazy. Yeah. I think we just heard from the marketing crew back there behind the camera. We have an international interest trying to get us to work with them. So, for all of you listeners out there…Mike Rowe. We will come on and show you a dirty job, okay?
We’ve got dirty jobs. That would be awesome.
So, who are we talking to today?
All right. So today our guest is the one and only Mr. Darrell Cloudt with Energy Solutions of Texas. He is a fan installer that we have been working with for about 15 years or so.
Yeah. That’s crazy. We talked about it with him earlier, but I was just kind of laughing about, Darrell was here before I was. And then I was helping out with doing layouts and things and then suddenly get one from him. And it’s just very precise, very different from everything else that we get. And he’s like, this is where I’m putting it. And this is where it’s going. And this is the amount we’re using. Give me the drawing. It’s like, we sure we trust this guy? Like, does he know the stuff?
No questions asked.
And then sure enough, he does. And he he’s hung more fans than anybody.
And the thing is, when he sends in the layout requests, you just give him what he asked for because he’s going to install it and he’s going to fix it. He’ll make it work.
Yeah, I know. It’s his fault if he breaks it.
But no, we love getting to have Darrell in here. Came all the way from Texas.
That’s right. Brought a crew with him, too.
I know. They’re here for their annual recertification. We do keep our installers accurate, up to date with the latest technology that we’re producing and putting out there and get them recertified. Get them up to date on our safety standards and requirements just so that they can get out to your facilities and have a great install. So, it’s great to have him and his crew in, getting to relearn the things. And even learn from them, because they’ve been out there and been there, done that.
That’s right. All right. Without any further ado, here’s our interview with Darrell Cloudt. Check it out. Thank you.
All right. Welcome to our very special guest. The one, the only Mr. Darrell Cloudt. Straight from Texas. Long hard wagon trail here.
Just to come be on the podcast, too.
That’s it. I’m just kidding.
Yeah, two hour flight.
So, Darrell is with Energy Solutions of Texas, and we’ve been working together for probably close to 15 years now.
It has been.
It’s been a minute. So, I just remember the way it started in my mind was, our receptionist at the time said, Hey, there’s this guy from Texas and he’s on the phone and, and there’s a fan project we’re doing down in Waco, Texas. And he’s calling about that project. And I’m like, that project’s done. It’s in the books. Like it’s happening. Like it’s a Domtar diaper plant and we’ve already sold the fans and like, I do not need to talk to a contractor. It’s whatever. And then about two days later, Hey, that guy from Waco, Texas is on the phone again. And I’m like, we’re good. Like tell him we don’t need some contractor trying to get in the middle of this project or whatever. And then like two days later, Hey, that guy from Waco, Texas is on the phone. Okay. All right. So, let’s talk to Darrell. So, your journey, even before SonicAire, you’ve been in the industrial space. You’ve been in the trades kind of industry for quite a while. You started plumbing, right?
No, actually, the business started in 2010
Right. Energy Solutions started then. And originally, we were a commercial lighting company.
If you go back before that though, you had a stint with a big plumbing outfit?
Actually, I worked for Dwyer, which was a franchise company. And I was actually in charge of development for Mr. Electric worldwide. So, I had a sales team that worked for me. And we were in the process of filling the world with Mr. Electric franchises.
Mr. Electric. I guess I’m thinking Mr. Rooter.
Yeah, Mr. Rooter was one of our brands.
Okay. Yeah.
At the time we had seven brands. Of course all household services, and Mr. Rooter was probably the biggest one. Probably the most well-known.
I got the water and the electricity mixed up. You don’t want to do that.
Yeah, you normally don’t do that.
It’s a bad combo.
So, Mr. Electric to Energy Solutions of Texas. How did you make that jump? What was that like?
Well, the franchise model had worn thin on me, and I was done. And I just had an entrepreneurial spirit kind of all my life and really wanting to do something. And believe it or not, my manager and my mentor at the Dwyer group really encouraged me to do more, become more. Not to say that he was happy that I left because it surprised him. But he was one of the first people who said, if you ever need money, I’m your guy. And so, I got a lot of support from him, and it’s a great story. It’s a little longer story, but it’s a great story to how we got to where we are right now.
That’s great to have someone that believes in you that much. That’s willing to put their money where their mouth is. You know, we try to hold our employees like that with an open hand. And sometimes people outgrow the position that they’re in here. And we have to say that’s great. You’re bigger than the seat we have to offer you here. And so maybe it’s time to spread your wings a little bit.
Yeah. A lot of times it’s better for them to grow instead of just hitting their head over and over against the ceiling here. So, that’s awesome that you had some money that was able to push you into doing that.
Super encouraging.
Yeah. And then, so you were here before even like I was and everything. And I remember coming in, and I was helping Kevin at the time doing layouts on and off. And I would get these layouts, and it would be a piece of grid paper with a dot and the exact measurement and the mount. And I’m like, this is a little different than all the other guys that send in their stuff. Like he’s telling me exactly…like, are we good? Do we trust this guy? And I was like, yeah, Darrell. Don’t worry about it.
So, when did y’all link up? Like the phone call with Domtar and everything? So how did that all play out?
Yeah. So, at that point you were lighting predominantly.
We were actually doing a lighting project, and at the time it was AHP, which is Associated Hygienic Products.
That’s right.
So, it was pre-Domtar, but we were doing a lighting project for them. And the maintenance manager there said, Hey, we’re fixing to do these SonicAire fans. Will that affect the lighting? And then in my research, I figured out, you know, who you are and what you were doing. And it certainly did. Obviously, we were hanging large panel LEDs at the time. And so yes, it completely changed the scope of the lighting project. Everything went rigid mounted, which changed the scope, changed the cost. I mean, but we were happy to do it. And the customer was right for, you know, letting us know ahead of time that we were doing this. But that’s what piqued my interest. Then I had to find out more about what these fans are about.
Yeah. Darrell said, I’m already in the ceiling. I’m gridding the facility to put a distribution of lights in there. The fans seem like it would be kind of an easy fit and something that we could get on board with.
So, then from there, it started off SonicAire fans and installation. And now today you’ve probably installed more SonicAire fans than anybody.
I did a little math, and I think it was about midyear last year we hit around a thousand fans that we’ve installed.
Wow, that’s awesome.
It’s incredible. Yeah. It’s been a great partner. So are there any, well, let’s go back to, Do you remember the first install you did?
It was actually AHP.
Oh, you guys did the install on that one.
Yeah. We actually did. And boy, did we screw things up. I mean, it was a learning experience through the whole process. But we did make a lot of mistakes, but it was healthy. And I knew by doing that job and seeing where it went, and I became a believer once that job was done and I saw what it accomplished in the facility.
They didn’t do a pre-clean. So it was pretty egregious. But once I saw that, I thought, this is something, this is serious. I mean, this is a lot more than just fans in the ceiling. Because we had done Big Ass Fans in the past, and we were actually a dealer for Big Ass Fans. And I was like, this is not what I had envisioned would happen. So it was very impressive.
Well, and back to what you were saying about what you learned and kind of made a mess of some things and kind of tripped on yourself a little bit. So, one of the things that has come out of this partnership with you for us over the years is getting consistent, direct feedback on what we’re sending out the door. Because frequently when we send a fan to a customer and they try to install it themselves, number one, they’re probably going to mess it up. And I want to talk more about that here in a few minutes, but they might mess it up. And number two, they’ll figure it out and they’ll kind of make it work, but they probably won’t give us good, clear feedback on, Hey, you guys could do this better. If you put this in the box a little different, if you’d made these wires consistent across every fan, this would be a little better and things like that. And that’s the feedback that you’ve been able to give us because you’ve done so many of them. You go, Hey, every time we touch this fan, we have to do X, Y, or Z. Can you just do that on the front end so we don’t have to do it on the back end? It certainly helped us create a better product.
Oh yeah. No, I think a lot of our innovations spur off of the feedback we get from the field. We met with the service team yesterday, and we’re just going through like, Hey, these are some of the issues that we ran into and how can we make them better? We’ve had a few here recently where we’ve changed up some odds and ends just from learning more and more about kind of the install process. But yeah, let me ask about some of those mistakes because obviously when the fan shows up, it’s something that everybody has definitely seen before, an overhead oscillating fan. And so, they definitely understand exactly how it goes in. But like, all kidding aside, what was that like? Because it’s a pretty niche product. It looks funky. It acts funky in what you’re trying to do with it, spinning around and up and down and setting everything up. How did that go? And what was kind of the learning process behind that?
Well, it was kind of an amazement because we were still in the process of doing the lighting job. And brought a couple extra guys in that could focus on the electrical for the SonicAire fans. And when we took the box top off for the first time, there was probably about eight, nine guys standing around. And we were all just scratching our head, looking at it, thinking what in the world have we gotten ourselves into? You know, how do we get that from there to there without killing ourselves or dropping the fan or whatever? And so, there was a lot of, we actually read the manuals. You know, a bunch of men that actually read manuals and instructions. Luckily I had a project manager at the time, and he had a, I wouldn’t say an engineering background, but an engineering mentality. And so, he sliced and diced it. And he really did a lot of reading. He did a lot of background on it. And I think he actually made a couple of calls to engineering here, and we figured it out. But it was still a challenge. Because that job was, it was around 20 fans. So, it was no small job.
That’s sizeable, yeah.
And there was a considerable amount of conduit and electrical to run. That part went actually pretty well, getting access to where the fans needed to be because we didn’t do the layout, the layout was predetermined. I’m not sure that anybody went to the facility and actually walked the facility and did a layout or if it was a, you know, this is where the fans should go based off the drawing. And I have a feeling that’s probably going to be the latter. And so, access was really tough. We didn’t know what we didn’t know. So we had to get the fans right where they were supposed to go. Because that was the scope.
It’s on the print, yeah. I probably did the layout for that. Yeah, that was probably one they sent us in a, you know, a rectangular box. Here’s the ceiling, you know, with no regard to where the lines were and the equipment and the ductwork and none of that stuff.
Yeah. That’s what you always run into, is the vast amount of ductwork. Because, you know, all those lines had dust collection. And it was no small system. I mean, that was a considerable system. And that’s where we met Joey, at that time. He was working on the dust collection system, getting it up to par.
Yeah. And, and if I remember correctly, you and I visited there after the fans were installed and I think there was some large flexible duct in the ceiling there too?
There was a little bit. Yeah. It was in an area that wasn’t being utilized. So I think we made some changes in the layout on that, if I remember correctly, to allow.
Yeah, make it fit.
Well, I mean, like being on the engineering side of things, we get some funky drawings. Like, we get everything from here’s the 3d model with the doorknobs for the bathrooms, and you can walk in and you can see like how much toilet paper stock they have in there to, uh, this is our address. Pull it up on Google Maps. It’ll be kind of close.
And here’s the fire escape plan, not drawn to scale. You get those, too.
Yeah. And it’s 17 different scales on there, but this is where we meet up for the fire. So yeah, I mean, so if that was the first install, walk us through like some of the crazy ones that you’ve seen, like intense processes, or just access issues, or difficult working schedules or timing schedules.
Environment.
Yeah. What’s been the more challenging things?
You know, as it relates to the fans, I guess, in the early days, one of the jobs that kind of sticks out in my mind was we did a job for [redacted]. And it was in Sweetwater. And we hadn’t done a lot of jobs, but you know, I was understanding the concept and what we were trying to achieve. And this was a either five or six story tower. And each room was no more than 12 or 15 by 15. So they were fairly small, grated floors. And we ended up putting a fan on each floor. I had underestimated the need for access and how we were going to get equipment, electrical, everything to each floor. And that job was really a challenge. The guys struggled on it. I struggled on it. I was there the entire time and really just watched over that job because I wanted it to go well because I wanted a relationship with [redacted]. But when that job started up, the success that we had out of that was absolutely amazing because everything worked like it was supposed to. And we achieved the goal by getting all of that dust from floor to floor to floor to floor.
And actually had to run everybody out of the mill in that area because the dust was so bad. But that was one of the fun ones. The most interesting one: I looked at a job for a company called [redacted]. And it was food related, and they pre-make all the food, and then they cook it and then they flash freeze it. So, walking through that facility and doing a layout and thinking about everything that had to happen within that was probably the most interesting, because you had, you know, a negative 30 freezer over here, and then you had a room where they were cooking taquitos or whatever in a matter of seconds. And I don’t know, the changes from area to area was just absolutely amazing. We ended up doing a lighting job for them. And there was some real opportunity, I believe, with the fans. But, you know, at that point, especially early on, fans in a food service facility normally, you know, don’t mix well. But that was probably the one of the most interesting, very diverse.
Here lately you’ve been in like outdoor grain elevator type of situations and some outdoor mezzanines and things like that. How’s that been going?
That is probably the last job that we just wrapped up. Do you want to talk about the name of it?
We can leave it out. But it’s a port loading facility.
A port loading facility, milling operation. Probably, definitely the most challenging job we’ve ever had.
I’ve seen pictures of this place. It looks like a spider made out of metal. And like, if you’re looking at a top-down thing, the way that they have everything, it goes across the river, like through the port area. And it just looks like this manmade bug out there.
Yeah. It’s enormous.
You guys actually had to crane fans in.
We did. So, the first project was pretty straightforward. It was down on the bottom floor. Access was scaffold only, which they have a great scaffold crew there that really worked with us and got us where we needed to be. That job went off without a hitch. Still a little challenging, but something new. And, of course, that was the first, I think, Div 1 job that we did with you. Class II Div 1. The second job was…
Shout out UL.
Yeah. Shout out.
We try to talk about UL in every single podcast.
Yeah. Make sure to give them some love. They have yet to reach out or respond to our podcast.
No kickbacks?
I think they’re going to sponsor us. I heard that they might sponsor us for all the mentions they get.
Yeah. We’re driving up their AI SEO, whatever it’s called.
Now, the roof of the building was 210 feet off the ground. Then the building that we installed fans in was on 50 foot stilts on top of that. And then there were five floors of fans on top of that. And so, yes, we had a 230 foot crane, and we hoisted all the fans. I got some really cool videos, I think I sent you one, raising the fans to the roof of the building. And from then on, it was just sheer muscle.
We had a lot of intermediate hoist points that we used. But the logistics of that job was just so challenging. And it was during their shutdown, which always occurs July and August. And so, you know, July and August in Louisiana.
I heard it was a little wet.
Well, it was a little wet for a lot of reasons. Number one, humidity was off the chart. We had some serious rainstorms that came through. And yeah, it’s an indoor job, but not exactly a waterproof facility. So it was a real challenge.
So, you mix corn and water. And what do you get? Mold. And so it was a pretty hostile environment. Not a place that you would want to work a lot in. You don’t want to spend a lot of hours in there. And the guys, I feel sorry for them, because it was a very, very rough install. So, glad that one’s over.
So obviously, that was not a low budget install, but ultimately the customer has seen the value in it. There’s obviously an ROI.
Absolutely.
Because they keep ordering more fans and doing more projects with us.
That was the third project. And, you know, the last thing they told Omar, see you next year. So, they’re teeing up another one. And that’s really their once a year shutdowns. Kind of the only time that we can get in there. And they’re going to need to service the fans while we’re there. We did a PM on the remainder of the fans while we were there.
Sure. Yeah. Speaking of PMs, you’ve seen some pretty nasty fans that have been neglected.
Oh my, yes. Showstoppers.
You’ve sent me a few pictures. I’ll be somewhere eating dinner or something on a Thursday night, and I’ll get a buzz from Darrell and he’ll go, what is that? You’ve seen some good ones. Talk about that.
Yeah. We had one location where we actually got out 33 pounds of material out of a shroud and off of a blade. So, 33 pounds.
These are not dust collectors. Not supposed to be.
Obviously they are.
Yeah, there was so much in it. And we were having gear motor problems at that facility, as you can imagine. But I asked the guys, I was like, chisel that out and I want to wait because this is obviously going into the Guinness’s book of, you know, heavyweight…
Fan records? Yeah.
So, yeah, I got the official weight. And it’s remarkable that you can put 33-ish pounds of material inside of a shroud and wrapped around a motor.
That’s mind blowing.
Yeah. And honestly, it’s pretty crazy because we do an annual PM. So that’s one year’s worth of material stacked up in that fan. And now we’re on a six-month rotation with them. At least for that part of the facility.
What type of dust is that?
So, they make countertops. And the material they use is a non-porous material. It’s almost the consistency of, like, gypsum. But they pour into countertops, and they use them for clean rooms and medical. It’s completely non-porous. So obviously, you know, it won’t allow diseases and microbes and things to grow and things like that. So, it’s incredibly heavy and incredibly dense, and they pour it super high temperatures. So, it starts out as a powder, and then they add some different chemicals or water to it. Then they take it out and they mill it and plane it and router it for different applications. So out the back door goes a complete ready to stick on countertop.
And into the ceiling goes all the dust without a SonicAire fan to protect them against all that. Is that a combustible dust?
It was very low combustibility. That was strictly a housekeeping job. There’s no question. I think it had some element to it early on in the process. Yes. In the tower. Yeah. That’s where the real problem is. Once it gets out, it’s just a housekeeping issue.
Yeah. I’m always amazed when we get them back to fix them and, you know, everybody gets called out to the shop. They’re like, take a look at this one. Because some process somewhere has turned it into a giant pinata or a paper mache project or something. And we get the paint scrapers out and the pressure washer and clean it up and get it up and running again. But yeah, be like Darrell, read your manual. We have recommendations for how often these things should be serviced, because your environment is different than your neighbors. So, make sure you’re keeping up with that, or hit up the Parts and Service department. We’ll take care of you.
That’s right. We’ll get it scheduled and make sure it runs for a very long time. Because you do, you know, we want to think these things will run forever. And with the proper maintenance, they just might. But they are a moving, operating piece of equipment in a very harsh environment in most cases. And the harsher the environment, the more often they need to be touched and cared for.
Well, you and I had a conversation one time and I asked you, I said, how many fans do you think that you’ve sent out the back door that are not installed yet?
Yeah. There’s a few of them.
How many fans arrive at a facility and they sit? I mean, I know of several that have gone to grain mills that have sat for over two years before they were ever installed. And that was one of my pitches to you is, you know, we’re going to get them installed. They come to me. They’re my customer. Those guys, they’re going to get hung. I’m going to make sure of that. And then second, you know, how many fans I ask you, how many fans do you think you have hanging out there that are not operational?
And I guess that goes to everybody out there. How many fans do you have that aren’t working because they haven’t been serviced? You know, when’s the last time you walked out and actually looked at your fans and paid attention to what was going on? My old boss used to say, inspect what you expect.
That’s right.
You know, when’s the last time you’ve inspected the process? So, that’s a big deal. I mean, you’ve got a lot of money wrapped up in these assets. You need to make sure that they’re working for you.
That’s right. They do an amazing job, but you do have to keep them going.
Yeah. So, what have you seen that’s changed over your 15 years of working with us from, you know, not just like us and our product, but like how are customers approaching dust differently? What other practices have been put in place? You know, how have you seen technology come and go, all tackling this issue of dust and housekeeping?
At the customer level…You know, in 2012, when we were out there, it was just a tremendous amount of ignorance. I mean, they just didn’t know what they didn’t know. And, you know, if you talk to a customer that did know, then obviously they were very engaged. And back then, you know, it was primarily in the wood.
Right.
You know, the laundries have been around. You guys have been doing laundries. And so, you know, they were well aware of the need for housekeeping. But, you know, just cold calling and being out and talking to people. There was a lot of curiosity, but more ignorance. And getting past that was, you know, much more of a challenge. I think today, most people are aware that there are challenges like that. They may not know specifically for their product or their industry or, you know, what’s going on as far as the technology that’s offered or the solutions. And they’re curious. But I think there’s a lot more information out there now. I think you guys have done a really good job informing, you know, different industries and different applications. I think that’s gone a long way. Just simple things like this. I think people learn.
Unfortunately, I think where they learn from are the mistakes and, you know, fires, explosions, hazardous incidents, you know? And that’s an unfortunate way to learn, but it does wake people up. And the media has run with a lot of a lot of that. So, that gets people moving. Always.
As far as technology, you know, the fans, golly, they’ve come so far. You know, I’ve seen so many evolutions and so many different variations and, you know, again, lots of mistakes and lots of successes. And I’m really excited about the fans that are coming out now. You know, the P200 is just a rock solid fan. Such an amazing piece of equipment, and the reliability is so much better. I mean, in the gear motor upgrades and the drive upgrades that have been done.
So, I’ve been able to be present for the evolution of where we are today. And, you know, seeing where we came from to, you know, where you’re at now is pretty remarkable. It’s a lot of fun.
Oh yeah.
Still climbing.
Absolutely. I hope it doesn’t stop.
A little better every day.
That’s it. Do you think, anything with regulations, DHAs, the dust hazard analysis, the new NFPA 660, is any of that trickling down, or is any of that driving people’s awareness or their, you know, engagement at all? Have you seen that?
I don’t think so. Because, you know, I try to have some of those conversations. You know, I had a little short meeting and conversation with [redacted] about an application down in Texas. And, you know, [redacted] being who they are, I would have thought that, you know, that that conversation would not have fallen on deaf ears, but it was like I was speaking a different language. Now it may be just the person I was talking to. But the project was nonetheless needed for their application, and they were the corporate engineer for that division. So, I would have expected just a little bit more. Again, could have been just the person.
Sure.
But no, I think it just comes down to, at the end of the day, a housekeeping issue, you know, whether it’s combustible or not. Yeah, that’s a big deal, but it’s simple housekeeping.
Yeah. Well, I mean, that’s like the thing that we run into even doing the trade shows and stuff. Like we’ll get people that come up to us, and they’re like, I’m having to stop production. I’m having to clean. I’m having to pay somebody to clean. And we’ve got to shut down and we can’t make the money. They’re not coming up and saying, Hey, 660 section this, dot this, dot that. You know, they’ve got an outside body doing that or their EH&S manager doing that. But your general end user is not necessarily tied up in that. And that’s where we try to work with some of those insuring bodies or the AHJs so that we can get the education out there before it’s too late, right? Because we’ve talked about several instances this year, you know, local to our area and up and down the east coast where there’s been explosions, and then it’s too late, right? You’re having to react to this. And so that’s where we’re trying to be that proactive solution. And that’s where all the education bits come from and why we want to get people informed so we don’t have to go cite codes, but we can just say, Hey, this is going to prevent you from doing things that you aren’t necessarily good at so that you can do the things that you’re good at and make you money.
That’s it.
I have seen several projects really driven by insurance companies. And I think it’s in their best interest to have these things done. And when you’re an insurer says that, you know, your rates are going up or we’re going to drop you, you tend to listen a little bit better.
You get serious.
So, let’s run through just some different things that we hear. And then you can give your perspective kind of from, you’ve been in way more facilities than we have. And so, just give us your thoughts. First thing that comes to mind. We have customers say our dust collector is working. We don’t need fans.
How do you respond to that?
How do I respond to that? Well, first off, let’s go take a walk. When’s the last time maybe you’ve taken a walk? And when’s the last time you’ve been in a lift? When’s the last time you’ve been in your ceiling? You know, do you inspect your process?
That’s probably the biggest challenge that I have is getting them to understand: it’s a lot worse than you think it is. And, you know, every time you do a startup, they realize you were right. And they see the value after that, obviously. I want to take a walk. We really need to go look.
Does that involve getting in a lift most of the time?
At times.
Because it’s out of sight, out of mind, right?
Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, they see a clean floor, but that’s not the picture of really what’s going on. But understanding what’s going on up there and the thermal currents and where that dust is, just years and years and years of subtle, you know, it’s tough.
And that’s the most dangerous dust. We talk about that all the time. It’s the lightest, it’s the finest. It’s also the driest. And that’s the stuff that will rain down if you have that primary event and then you have the secondary explosion. That’s where the big hazard is.
You talked about this with that first installation a little bit. They didn’t do a pre-clean. And so, one of the things that we hear is like, don’t worry about it. Just turn them on. We’ll be good. How do you tackle that and combat that when you hear that today?
I go back to my last statement. It’s worse than you think it is. It always is.
So, in preparation for a job, we always have a pre-construction call or a pre-project call. And Emalee and I get on with the customer, and I do my best to recommend that we do a really good pre-clean.
Especially for us in the South because we deal with a lot of humidity. And that humidity and dust over time really cakes up. And you can’t expect that fan in a matter of days or weeks to chisel away at the crust that’s been there for years. It’s just not going to do it. We have one instance where we just finished a job. They just came up on their first year. And it’s just now getting to the point of, we’re starting to see some shiny behind the paint.
That’s amazing. It’s still getting the facility cleaner a year later.
Yeah, it’s still working on it. It’s just because they refuse to do their pre-clean. And they just need to get up there and chisel. It’s going to be a tough job. But if you want it back to where it was, it’s what’s required. You’ve got to do that pre-clean.
I went and helped on an install, one that we did kind of early on in-house. And we got there. We got them hung. And I was talking to the maintenance manager. I’m like, you said you did a pre-clean, right? I was just up in the ceiling. It’s kind of…He’s like, yeah, we pre-cleaned. It was probably about three weeks ago. And I was like, Alright, we’ll see how it goes. And we get to the end of their driveway. And they’re like, hey, we had to turn it off. It’s a mess in here. Can you come back? Can you take a look? What’s going on? And we get in there and we see. And I was like, this is what we were talking about. It’s going to find the dust. It’s going to take that like, caking off. It’s going to push around this stuff. And so, yeah, it’s super important to tie those things together. The fans, it’ll do the job, but we want you to be safe and compliant and not mess up any of your processes. So, pre-cleaning is super important.
I actually had a guy that paid for a pre-clean. And I forgot what he paid per square foot, but he was throwing a fit about it when we were down there doing the install of the fans. And when we started up, I mean, he just immediately turned back and he said, I’m out of here. And I was like, are you OK? He’s like, Man, I’m going back to my office. I’m going to call that company and get my money back. I got hosed.
Yeah, it finds the dust.
It’s amazing.
It’ll get it out of every little nook and cranny.
And they did a blow down, which is kind of unheard of now. You know, they actually got in there with air wands and were actually getting after it. And it still didn’t hold a candle.
That’s wild. So, once you’ve made it through the initial startup and the initial cleaning and you’ve got that out of the way and you’re at a constant run state. So, a lot of customers talk to us or, you know, pre-customers will say, Where’s the dust go? Doesn’t it just blow it around? Doesn’t it just keep it in suspension? What’s been your experience or how do you respond to that when somebody says, Well, it’s just going to keep circulating the dust. Where’s the dust go? Talk about air quality and what’s been your experience with it.
Rarely have I seen an occasion where the dust stays stirred up. Unless you’re dealing with a really low ceiling application and the dust really has no place to go, or the oscillation settings on the fans are not set correct, you know, and you’re picking dust back up off the floor. It’s only been an occasion that we’ve seen that where a really tight confined space where the dust really has no place to go. Other than that, it’s always ended up on the ground. It doesn’t matter what kind of dust it is. It always ends up on the ground. It always ends up on a horizontal surface. It’s not touched by the fans. Not one occasion. Ever.
It seems to me like the air is clearer. Like you can see it in the lights. There’s not the haze that maybe you see before you go on your initial site visits, you see a haze in the plant or whatever. And it just seems to clear it up.
There’s no question. You know, I have no scientific evidence to prove that you’re right or wrong on that, but I agree with you. I mean, I see it.
You know, we do multiple projects for the same customer. And it’s very unique that we go in and do two or three fans and we not go back and do more ever. So, I think the biggest part of my business is reoccurring business with the customers, whether it’s service or installation of new fans. And, you know, I think that says a lot. So, they see what’s happened. They see how it’s been a success in one area, and they want to apply that same success to another area and then move through the facility.
As a matter of fact, if I’m there and it’s my customer and I’m working through the process with them, I want to try to stay focused on the biggest pain point. Let’s just stay focused here. I get that you want to look at all of that, but let’s stay focused on this, and let’s have our success here.
Rarely if ever does somebody buy all the fans they need on the first shot.
Absolutely.
And that’s kind of the beauty of the fan system too, because it’s modular. You can start out with just a couple of fans and try it, make sure it works for you, works for your application. We can better understand your type of dust and make sure it’s good for everybody. And then we can go out from there and just grow and add on. So, it’s pretty sweet.
Absolutely. And with our installations using y’all’s controls, we set it up so that the fans can be added to the system. You know, we have 16 fans on a controller, so we’re ready for more. The infrastructure is in place.
Always room to expand.
Absolutely.
And I love just kind of the beauty of being able to tell the customer like, yeah, just put us in your worst area. Put it in the worst area, we’ll talk to you in a month, and we’ll get the rest of the project squared away.
So, you’d be on the install end, you get a lot of the direct interaction with the customer as things are happening. So, what is something that they don’t realize or aren’t aware of until it’s install day, or until it’s commissioning day and startup? What’s something that is just recurring where they’re like, Oh, I didn’t realize, dot, dot, dot.
So, hard to believe that these fans are not Bluetooth.
Yet.
They do require electrical.
Yeah, they’re not wireless.
Maybe a solar fan, you know, with a lithium battery pack or something in the future.
It’s quite extensive. I mean, installing fans, it requires access to areas of the facility that are going to be inconvenient to your production. I can absolutely 100% assure you of that. Be ready. I mean, it’s simple. Be ready. And communicate. I think that’s probably the biggest. We’re going to have to communicate because we’re going to have to work together, but we’re also going to have to communicate of where we need to be and how we need to be there and how long we need to be there and what’s required to get this system installed into your facility.
I have the same spiel with everybody. Look, we’re going to be there five, six, seven days, whatever it takes to get the job done. I don’t want to be there any longer than I have to. You don’t want me there any longer than I have to be. So, in order for us to shorten this process and get through that, we’re going to have to communicate. And I need to know from you the things that are important. And I may not even know that. You’re going to have to tell me where can I be and where can I not be? What’s a sensitive area? We can go through an AHJ and we can identify hazards and we can do all these things, but I can’t work with your timeline and your production schedule unless I know what it is. And so, I want more information about how you operate, what you do in here, how you go about doing it, what’s important to you. We’re still going to have to get there, but we can figure out how we’re going to do it as long as we can communicate.
So come out from behind the desk, come walk with me, and let’s talk through it, because I don’t want to hear about it in your office. You’re not going to think about it. You’re not going to see it. It’s not going to remind you. You’re not going to tell me a story until we walk in the back. So, let’s go take a walk. Let’s get dirty. Let’s get high. Let’s go through this together. And I don’t want to talk to your second. I don’t want to talk to your maintenance guy that’s here for his first year. I need to talk to the guy who’s in charge of this, who knows all aspects of the business. Because they’re the ones that understand the inter-department relationships and the reliability that what has to happen.
Because it’s either have that conversation in a casual manner upfront, or they’re going to come out angry at you. Because you’re in the wrong space and you can’t be there and we got to get through there.
Absolutely. And inevitably it happens. Yeah. There’s no doubt about it.
And help you identify a safe space where you can stage everything and all that.
You know, that’s rarely ever been a challenge.
Really?
Most of the time it’s access. We don’t want you in here. We don’t want you over this machine. Okay.
Where’s the fan going?
Where would you like to move that, sir?
Where agreed to this drawing that has it right over that area.
Right. I will say that, in our pre-construction calls, Emalee does a great job. And as far as holding people accountable, recording what’s happening in our calls and being able to go back and say, Now you said…But I try to pry, and I ask the same question three or four times in different ways just trying to get to the bottom. Okay, there’s a challenge here somewhere. I’m looking for that challenge. And more often than not, it’s because communication.
Yeah. Better you can do it on the front end.
Yeah. I mean, it’s going to save everybody the headache. We don’t want you to be upset with us. We don’t want our crews to have to stall out and drag things out. So, the more details we can get up front, I tell this to the sales team all the time, just even from building equipment, you know, the more we can get up front, the better.
Absolutely. But you got to get out from behind that desk. You’ve got to take a walk. That’s the only way to find it.
That’s a lesson for all of us. Well, that’s what Tommy Cocanougher from Cintas said. I mean, that was kind of his one thing to encourage future generations is just go walk around and talk to employees. And his motto was take a notepad. Don’t pull your phone out. You’re going to get distracted by that. Take a notepad and a pencil and just write down notes. Listen to people. Figure out what’s going on.
You know, when I’m doing audits, I still do this. Even when I do audits for you guys, I still do this. I talk to people on the floor. What are you doing here? Tell me about your job. How often do you go up on that mezzanine? What do you do on that mezzanine? I see all those bags up there. Tell me what goes on up there. How often do you go up there?
Be curious. I think that’s word for everybody. Be curious, because then you start asking questions and you learn, Wow, I am going to create a real problem with a fan right there. How are we going to get past that? What are we going to do to avoid that? And inevitably, it’s going to come back, because you’re going to put that fan up and that guy’s going to go up there and cut open a 50 pound bag, and there you have it. Now you’ve got the bomb. So being able to prepare for that. Be curious.
And not only that. So, you started the conversation. So now you’re building a relationship. So, when you come back in to do the install, you’re like, Hey, Joe, I’ve talked to you before, remember? I’m the guy here with the fans. And so like, can you guide me on this or whatever? So now you’ve opened the door for some communication.
Well, you know I’m a relationship person. And I would say this, whether you’re going to do fans or you’re going to do dust collection or whatever your mitigation that you’re going to do, I think it’s important that you find somebody to work with that you can trust and then have that relationship. I can’t do what I do every day without having a relationship with my customer. And it’s devastating for me when I lose a contact at a particular facility that I’ve been working with for years. And ironically, I’ve got two customers that I’ve been working with since, oh gosh, probably seven or eight years. And they’re both retiring this month. And we had this long conversation and wished them well and all that. But, you know, now I’m, Okay. Who’s the guy? I need to talk to him. I need to take him to lunch. I need to have that relationship. Otherwise, I can’t have good communication without that relationship. So, it’s big for me.
But with that relationship, man, I can just walk into any facility and just, you know, wave at the people at the front and just, I’m there. I’m supposed to be there. So, it’s great to be in that position. I love being able to do that.
So, clearly you’ve got some great relationships with some great folks and great customers. So, have you ever gotten a call six months later, Hey, man, these things are doing XYZ or what kind of feedback comes to mind that’s happened kind of after the fact. Any success stories or anything like that?
We had one, you probably remember, Kent Moore.
Yeah. They did a video for us.
So, it wasn’t quite six months, but it was a couple of months afterwards. And it was, You need to come back. We need to talk. This has been great. This is over and above what we expected. Which, you know, I’ve gotten that call before, normally not that quick though. And he was genuine. I mean, I arrived and we went into a room and he sat down and he’s, you know, I didn’t believe, I didn’t believe. Almost to the point of apology, I’m sorry I questioned you kind of thing. We still maintain a good relationship for that. But it was a lot of fun. I mean, it’s great to make people happy. I like to make people happy.
Yeah, that was quite a transformation. We’ll make sure we put the link down below so people can check that one out.
That was a wonderful job. They still take good care of their fans and they work hard. I talk to them quarterly. Good people.
Love it. That’s awesome. So where do you see us going next? Where’s the next 15 years of dust and just kind of the industrial space, and what’s on the horizon, you think?
Well, I hope there’s more education. And it’s the good education, not the explosion on the 10 o’clock news.
Right.
I’d much rather it be safe and secure and people take it to heart, but I hope there’s more education. I see a lot of potential in plastics. I hope that plastics wakes up and comes to the realization of the opportunities they have in all parts of plastic, you know, between recycle and everything. I think there’s tremendous opportunities in plastics. So, I’d like to see a lot more with that. And it’s where it’s where a lot of industry is headed too. I mean, we’re seeing more and more things made from plastics, and we’re seeing more recycle products out there. So, I see a big development with plastics, I think.
Yeah, dusty parts to that for sure. Especially in the grind and the pellets.
But it’s one of those things, just working in dust, you just figure out how all of these things are put together. We’ve recently dabbled around with some metal stuff. And then you start to realize how long that supply chain is, everything from getting the raw material to processing it at a foundry. And then all of the byproducts that are used to cast the different things and then the milling and grinding and forming operations. And that goes for everything that’s made. I mean, you think about the process of getting paper or tissue or anything like that. Everything from the tree to the diaper once you get way down the line. So, it is really amazing on how you get these different things.
And so, yeah, every step of the process is dirty and dusty and needs SonicAire fans.
That’s right.
It’s one of the greatest, I think, things about my job and what I do is I get to go in all these places and see how all this stuff’s made. You know, I’m kind of a nerd. I like to watch that show How It’s Made. It’s one of my favorites. And, you know, to see how it’s made. I get really curious. And I love the wood industry. I mean, it’s where we really got our start, plywood, particle board, OSB and still to this day, it’s just amazing. I can watch a forming line and watch a press for hours. And it’s just I don’t know. That’s pretty nerdy, but it’s fun. It’s fun for me.
How It’s Made and Dirty Jobs. Mike Rowe, if you’re looking for a podcast opportunity…
There you go.
We will definitely boost your numbers.
Perfect opportunity. Absolutely. And I’ve got a place for you to go for the dirty job. I’ll hook you up.
Yeah, that’s right. We got some ideas. All right. Well, hey, it’s been great having you on the podcast. Thanks for joining us today.
Yeah, it’s been fun.
Here’s to the next 15 years. I’m excited about it.
As good as the last, the best that you had to come.
There you go. All right. So that’s it for today. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for watching and checking out another episode of the OnAire podcast. We’ll see you next time.